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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 16 2009 : 13:24:32
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My name is Chris and I have in my position an old book called ...il fabbro moderno by L.Picasso.... editore Antonio vallardi Milano.
I would like to ask for more information, if you pleased, about the author and generally the book.
Is it posible the book author (L.Picasso) real name is Pablo Picasso.
It compose only 24 tables designs-drawnings.
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wasbach
Advanced Member
Germany
1594 Posts |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 16 2009 : 15:58:41
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Ask there....this is the answer....
Kalimera kirie Christos,
Thanks for your e-mail. Unfortunately all we know about this book is what you can read on our web site. If you will Know some news about the possibility tha the autor can be Pablo Picasso please contact me
Best regards
And this is the editore Vallardi answer.....
Hello Mr Christos..
We are sorry. We dont¢have an Archive of so old Memorandum of agreement, so we can¢t find any information about the author.
Best regards,
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 16 2009 : 17:03:26
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Why you are so sure is not a Pablo Picasso book???
From my recently communication with on of the biggest auction house in the world i received the following mail...
Dear Mr. .....
Thank you for contacting ......... regarding the possible sale of your property. Our specialists are interested in learning more about it and invite you to send clearer images of the title page of the book for their review. To help us assist you in the most efficient way, we request that you attach your images to an email including item description and provenance........
And the last one.....
Dear Mr. ........
Thank you for contacting ........ regarding the possible sale of your property. Our specialists have carefully reviewed the information you kindly sent to us and have requested that I share with you their response. Unfortunately, based on the information provided, your property does not appear to fall into a property category or value level that ........ currently handles for sale. For that reason, our specialists are not able to suggest an estimate or provide other information.
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wasbach
Advanced Member
Germany
1594 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2009 : 04:23:45
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Hi Mr. Tsonias,
no one's life has been plumbed like Pablo Picasso's life.
It's impossible, that this would have rested a secret up to today, sorry.
Regards
Wasbach
PS.: Isn't there a year of printing in the book?
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Vietato
Average Member
Denmark
410 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2009 : 09:09:13
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Maybe Pablo Diego José Francisco de Paula Juan Nepomuceno María de los Remedios Cipriano de la Santísima Trinidad Mártir Patricio Ruiz y Picasso decided to call himself just L. in his little extra job doing designs for garden fences and doors.
Regards,
Vietato
____________________
e-store: Vietato's Gallery
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2009 : 11:13:44
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Yes....why not???
Picasso used to paint lots of things.
One of his mother name was Lopez...or maybe the (L) probably was a mistake.
Hi Wasbach...
No it doesn't exist the edition year in the book or any other element inside.
Regards,
Chris
P.S...look the fish in the foto
and the other foto
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Edited by - ivigo on Jun 17 2009 11:36:55 |
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bluemlein
Senior Member
680 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2009 : 12:15:29
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chris
please look at the very beginning and the very back of the book for a block of text, a colophon, which will tell you not just the publisher's name but a date, and possibly some other information. also, please also take a good, clear, large photo of the bottom left text on the illustrated pages and post it.
beyond that, it is clearly a book about metalwork, including stained glass, which is scarce - if not nearly extinct - in its own right. get a couple of sheets of acid free tissue paper and wrap the book in it.
as for the name Picasso, it is not owned by pablo ruiz or his descendants. there are, for example, over 400 picassos in the italian white pages, of which twenty are "L" - luigi, luciano, etc. so it is entirely likely that a blacksmith named luigi, or lombardo, or luciano picasso produced one book.
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tom0887
Junior Member
177 Posts |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2009 : 15:28:28
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Hi bluemlein...
I'm not supporting and being so absolute about the authors name ,was Pablo Picasso.
But i couldn't find any more informations about it, or information about happening by chance from other possible author.
We just have a conversation for all the probabilities that exist and about the value of the book , which function the contents .
I look the book very well .....(me and the Italian museum people ) but don't have anything else.
The bottom left text on the illustrated pages write ...( Diritti riservati-rights reserved )
I see many italian names with the " L" before the Picasso but no one the paint or design artist.
Best regards
Chris
Hi tom0887...
Thanks for the search ...but the book possible published between 1900-1940
Regards
Chris
ATTACHMENTS:
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Edited by - ivigo on Jun 17 2009 15:43:28 |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 19 2009 : 16:44:10
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Hi....
Two days search ...many and many hours..for the mystery Italian Picasso....but nothing....
My eyes see bird's and star's.....
At least the book worth something after all the job(search) I've done.
Regards
Chris
P.S....Maybe ....(ha..ha...) Picasso essays print with different name for confuse us......( i hope for that)
ATTACHMENTS:
P5040091.JPG
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Edited by - ivigo on Jun 19 2009 16:45:37 |
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bluemlein
Senior Member
680 Posts |
Posted - Jun 20 2009 : 15:29:43
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| what does it say at the bottom left corner(s) of the page(s)
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 20 2009 : 16:06:06
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Çi ....
I believe you mean these words ( Diritti riservati-rights reserved to Picasso )
Ok....not a essays print.....
Thanks
Chris
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 20 2009 : 16:29:12
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Hi bluemlein....
I search for metalworker, ironworker,blacksmith, fabricated , painter and many other similar job....but ...L.PICASSO ....is a chost...
Open the earth and swallow it......
This ....( L )....
Regards
Chris
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Edited by - ivigo on Jun 20 2009 16:30:04 |
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cassandra
Starting Member
9 Posts |
Posted - Jun 21 2009 : 12:43:01
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[cite]tom0887
. . .
this lady could be the mysterious L. Picasso[/cite]
Clearly this book is pre-World War Two and most likely from the 1920s or earlier. "Loulou Picasso" is a contemporary artist.
Chris: I would, if I were you, forget about the "possibility" of "L. Picasso" being the egocentric Pablo. Picasso was so egotistical that the entire universe revolved around him (and one was ejected from the circle if one disagreed). Surely you do not think that he would have condoned publication of a book by "L." - not as much as a first name!
And please consider the possibility of Pablo engaging in the description of rather mundane and unimaginative iron works for bourgeois gardens. I, for one, must scotch that idea definitively. Take any image from that book and compare it to any black-and-white image of Pablo's. You should notice immediately the vast gulf that separates the two, artistically.
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 21 2009 : 13:22:37
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Hi cassandra..
Your idea is great...but we have to compare same similar Picasso's work .....
In 1917 ....similar year with the book....the Picasso designed and drawined theater seats....
Where are these work's to compare ?????
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TLWilliams
Senior Member
United Kingdom
728 Posts |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
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bluemlein
Senior Member
680 Posts |
Posted - Jun 26 2009 : 20:55:06
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ivigo
if any of those librarians even thought there was a possibility the picasso might have been the author, don't you think someone would have written a monograph on it by now? please put the idea to bed. i'm not saying any more on the subject.
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 27 2009 : 04:13:39
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Hi bluemlein...
you're idea is perfect.
I do not know if it will really take but sent a message with your idea.
Thanks
Chris
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bluemlein
Senior Member
680 Posts |
Posted - Jul 03 2009 : 16:28:00
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ivigo:
i now have heard from Dott.(Doctor) Elisa Zuri of Firenzelibri S.r.l.
"L. refers to the previous surname. Picasso's name is Giorgio. He didn't write Il fabbro moderno. I'm sorry.
Many thanks for your request."
i take it that Giorgio Picasso actually was involved with the graphics.
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jul 03 2009 : 19:06:03
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Hello bluemlein
I am sorry but i am afraid i didnt understant what exactly you say - you meening.
My L.PICASSO and PICASSO ,L. is the same man with the first name GIORGIO or are they two different persons????
Best regards
and thanks
Chris
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bluemlein
Senior Member
680 Posts |
Posted - Jul 03 2009 : 20:10:17
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| chris, this picasso's name is giorgio
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jul 04 2009 : 03:00:25
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Hi....
From the moment where they say that it did not write the book IL FABBRO MODERNO then it is different individuals.
Âefore many days I have sent email and asked information specifically for the writer, however still they have not answered yet.
Chris
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Jul 17 2009 : 06:03:44
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Çé...
Unfortunately again the search they is without result.
The L.PICASSO Remains a ghost.
Dear Mr. Christos
you will recieve an extimates for the digital reproduction of the two
book of L. Picasso, Mobili antichi. We don't have in our library the
other book request Il fabbro moderno. We also don't have bibliographical
notices about the author L. Picasso.
Best regards
Gian Luca Corradi
Ufficio Informazioni Bibliografiche
Biblioteca Nazionale Centrale di Firenze
Any new idea and help are welcoming.
Thanks
Chris
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2009 : 11:01:53
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Hi...
Finally we did not find to exist somebody with the initial L.
In that case there is a possibility the book author of that book to be the Pablo Picasso.
As much as you believe that work(book) does not belong to Pablo Picasso,
I believe you can'not proove that it doesn't belong to him through the moment there isn't any sourse to provide evidence from the opposite.
We have 1or 2 books with the name Picasso L, however we do not have nothing for the person with the name L....NOTHING.
What they have to say to us the experts about this resault???
Is it P.Picasso? #8230;. Isn't it P.Picasso?
And don't tell me that, PIcasso didn't paint something like that , because he paint and do many things in his life.
The letter (L) in Italy is the first letter of the word (Work)=Lavoro
Thanks anyway.....
Chris
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Edited by - ivigo on Aug 03 2009 02:41:19 |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Aug 20 2009 : 06:23:33
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hi...
Waiting response to my questions from
Biblioteca Nazionale Centrale di Firenze ,
I thought to ask you a question to a query raised in the Italian and wait for your answer.
In this point ,it seems to me a kind of strange to exsist one or two books
with the same author and copys in Greece and Italy and do not
exist ,any information and specific in Italy because the book publiced in
Italy and the author also likely to be Italians.
What person (author) is not well known will be signed only with a L. and no other information ?????
Use the name of Picasso to be known, without some other purpose ???
Trying to get a copy of the book in the library have to be able to collect data.
If someone can help on this ....
Also if someone can help telling me what are the steps to be followed in my attempt to get an edge ...
Those from the moment....
thanks Chris
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 13:57:43
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Hi...
I know in my problem with the book , the solution will propably given with the contact-
and ''with answer from Mrs Maya Picasso '' but I don¢t know how to get in touch.
I hope to help me someone.
Chris
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Edited by - ivigo on Sep 13 2009 04:48:36 |
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jesj1852
New Member
New Zealand
47 Posts |
Posted - Sep 13 2009 : 18:40:18
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Hi Chris,
look, try this bookseller (ask if he can email you pictures of his book or more information that you can double check with yours for instance).
The book he has for sale may be of a different edition of yours. I too don't think Pablo Picasso was the illustrator for this book, but it pays to follow all the leads you might get.Meanwhile look after your book.The book is with you. So don't be in a hurry to find a final answer for your query at once. Take it easy.
-The add is in Italian, and this is the translation-
"the book is "Il Fabbro moderno" (Lavagnola s.d. Turin. 250 new models of ironwork for buildings. Doors, gates, railings, stairs, gates, balconies, ecc.3 Edition. In-8 ° (cm. 24.4 x17, 2), pp. 158, (1) Fully illustrated with drawings. Br-ed. ill. Shadows and light fines for couples., Excellent interior. Bookseller Inventory # NCF036VI28)" and the link is
http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&tn=il+fabbro+moderno&x=15&y=3
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2009 : 01:49:27
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Hi ....
Hi jesj1852
I have looked and this and I sent and email with my book ,
but there is no new information.
This book that you think we can deal and be related to content with my own book, but is unrelated.
After consulting a second contact with the library in Italy received again the same answer.
<<,Dear Mr. Tsonias
sorry for the delay. We can only send you the extimate for the digital
reproduction of the book Mobili moderni. We don't have any other
information.
Best regards
Gian Luca Corradi
Ufficio Informazioni Bibliografiche
Biblioteca Nazionale Centrale di Firenze>>
We have an Italian (L. Picasso), who even in Italy
nobody knows.
But they have books in a museum and a large library.
Very strange.
And the book and the author is not too old.
I will continue and I hope some people to help.
I am open to any cooperation.
Best regards
Chris
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Sep 22 2009 : 02:32:03
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Hi...
With the latest datum and elements i found (from publisher,museum,libriary,collecters,forum,e.c.t) the result are these.
At the 90% i believe there is no existing person with the name L.Picasso.
( If you see carefully at the library of Florence ,before and after from the author Picasso L. all the other authors and writters with the same last name (PICASSO) they have the first name fullwrited and not with just the one and only letter.)
Exept another one which is probably the museum mistake ,because
not contain an element of any individual person.
See the link.
http://opac.bncf.firenze.sbn.it/opac/controller.jsp?action=listaautore_browse&browse_offs=651842
Certainly, this conclusion does not mean that, the L. Picasso is a P.Picasso.
We need to gather information that could lead even indirectly to such a this conclusion.
But first and the key is to prove 100% that there is no real person named L.Picasso .
The theme will follow, but I see NO help.
Chris
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wasbach
Advanced Member
Germany
1594 Posts |
Posted - Sep 22 2009 : 03:45:40
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quote:
At the 90% i believe there is no existing person with the name L.Picasso.
What do you mean by that? Your author "L. Picasso" with that name as a real person? Or what else?
There were and are many persons with the name "L. Picasso" in Italy.
Regards
Wasbach
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Sep 22 2009 : 09:47:21
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Hi wasbach.
I mean, the author of my book L. Picasso and the library Picasso L. in Florence there is a NOT a real person.
Not at least with this letter L in first name.
Yes....They are have many persons with the name "L. Picasso" in Italy
but no one who wrote any of these books and anyone who has something to do with the topic of books ,or painter ,deginer,metalworker or,or,or.
Best regards
Chris
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Vietato
Average Member
Denmark
410 Posts |
Posted - Sep 22 2009 : 10:04:53
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ivigo,
Earlier in this thread you were given information from a librarian of the Firenze library, that the author's first name is Giorgio and L. his middle initial (that's how I interpret the answer):
quote:
Originally posted by bluemlein
ivigo:
i now have heard from Dott.(Doctor) Elisa Zuri of Firenzelibri S.r.l.
"L. refers to the previous surname. Picasso's name is Giorgio. He didn't write Il fabbro moderno. I'm sorry.
Many thanks for your request."
i take it that Giorgio Picasso actually was involved with the graphics.
Why don't you accept that answer?
I, for one, think that we have gone far enough on this matter, which hasn't really to do with art.
Regards,
Vietato
____________________
e-store: Vietato's Gallery
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Edited by - Vietato on Sep 22 2009 10:07:26 |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Sep 22 2009 : 11:01:32
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Hi Vietato
If you noticed above I put 2 answers from the specific library and there I was told never to do something like that.
If you believe it is right that your answer to put above ... Jack and the information to found about the Giorgio L. Picasso.
(You can do it??)
If you notice says exactly ...
"L. refers to the previous surname. Picasso's name is Giorgio. He didn't write Il fabbro moderno.
Me, I believe it gave too little attention to something that is very important for art.
I am sure, anywone who had the book would say the same like me.
Who is not interested this issue, simply skips.
Best regards
Chris
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Edited by - ivigo on Sep 22 2009 12:55:22 |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Sep 29 2009 : 08:06:10
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Hi...
In addition to the to see if the book belonged to someone other than the P. Picasso, need to find some evidence in paintings that resemble the technique of P. Picasso.
The agendas of the book is very different from the works of Picasso, but certainly some common elements exist. (Shadows, plants, fish etc.)
It may not be exactly 100% the same but this has to do with the color reproduction and the issue of the project.
I put a page from the book and want to pay attention to plants.
I put also a Link to one of Picasso's work did the same period about the book, when he was in Rome.
http://picasso.shsu.edu/index.php?view=zoom&img=opp17-010&year=1917
I do not know whether to get it right the Link, but has ZOOM to see details.
Look at the plants is at the bottom of the painting.
Of course there are and the
other elements which are about the age of the book.
Thanks
Chris.
www.artwanted.com/ivigo
www.artwanted.com/ARETIA
ATTACHMENTS:
P5040091.JPG
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2009 : 11:21:39
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Hi again.
Seeing the works of Picasso, has noticed that, too many projects-works on musical subjects and musical instruments.
It is one of the favorite subject .
And I would ask, how many possibilitys they have, someone else with name Picasso ,in a book with 24 paintings-sketches and ironwork subjects, one of this subject to be directly related to music.HOW???
The stave .... an ARPA ... and a guitar in the style of Picasso.
Among the works of Picasso, I found this .....see the link.http://picasso.shsu.edu/index.php?view=zoom&img=opp14-236&year=1914 at the same period with the book.
Look at the attached photos ,at the point where i have marked.Is the same motive, and 3 times in the book and 3 in the painting with the same details on points.
It is a great chance to use it ,with a both of 2 Picassos.
Best regards to all.
Chris
www.artwanted.com/ivigo
www.artwanted.com/ARETIA
ATTACHMENTS:
P5040091.JPG
P5040076.JPG
yopp14-236.jpg
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ivigo
Junior Member
Greece
59 Posts |
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pfbnantes
New Member
France
20 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2009 : 09:07:40
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catalogo completo. L. Picasso. Il Fabbro Moderno. Antonio Vallardi. Roma Milano. Napoli. 25 manuale completo. Disegni Industriali. A. Vallardi. Milano ...
www.museoitalianoghisa.org/.../elenco-cataloghi-IT.pdf
very simple ...google.it ....you put the name of yr book and author and at the first page you can see that this book is in the catalogue pdf with the address above ... so to close this obessionnal debate with pablo Picasso your book is already known and referenced and has of course nothing to do with pablo Picasso
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pfbnantes
New Member
France
20 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2009 : 09:21:43
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for information the editor still exists :
Vallardi Editore - Via Belfiore 5 - 20145 Milano tel. +39 02 43811650-fax. 02 436923 - email info@vallardi.it -
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Possible Picasso book???
